Chat Clarificationsss.

[Fluory]

It seems that there are a lot of odd misconceptions about this.

A'ight, hi everyone. I'm a person, and I use the chat quite a lot.

To begin with, back in the dawn of the chat, within its AIM origins and early IRC origins, it was more of an unrestricted chat room. Slightly more. It's not like people talked about sex all day or anything of the sort -- no, indeed, it was just mostly an added flair at odd and obscure bits. It wasn't rampant, it was just there to add to the flavor and to enhance the experience.

But as times changed, so did the rules. They became more and more strict -- and I do believe that Gem got some sort of ban from the channel bot for saying the word sex once. That's a little... much, at least I thought as much. I did, indeed.

So did some other people.

And that's why there was this huge debate and stuff yesterday. Not cool, not fun, and I can't say I want to do that again. Ever.

But what was wanted from this debate, at least from my end?

Simply, more lax controls on censoring. Of course, things like yiff, in-depth discussion of anything sexual, racial slurs, et cetera definitely aren't something I want in there. That never was really wanted in there, to be honest. Although some people wanted to say that was the point of what I wanted, and I do apologize for coming off that way.. somehow.

What was wanted was just to be able to use minor cursing, slightly more taboo words (like sex -- I mean, sex is an official term for the gender of a person that's in forms everywhere, and I have known people who use it in the same context as cool at times "that is the sex" et cetera), and the ability to use innuendoes. Even when we could do the above, it never overruled in the past times of the chat -- none of us are really wild people who would take it too far most of the time, nor would it be a driving factor.

Just...

A possibility.

Perhaps the worst part of the more strict rule changes was- aside from the inflexibility of what we could and couldn't say- it just limited our previous freedoms that we had a lot of fun with.

I really didn't want to post this thread or bring this issue to the boards, but I wanted to disrupt the more fragile flow of the chat even less. Actually, I think the main reason why I've decided to post this at all was because this debate still touches today in its own areas, where other people are giving their voice. So I thought I might as well give my own.

Oh yeah, and I also sort of want to use this thread for some clarification stuff. >_> Again, this thread is for anything about the debate and what was wanted by either sides, so yeah. I don't actually like publicly posting this, but I feel like word-of-mouth travels around too fast for this sort of stuff to be reconciled with any effeciency in private. Forgive me.

Stuff to clarify:
I did not ask Ruru, EmBreon, or really anyone else to come into the chat. The only people I told about the argument were Contention and Lance, and I mostly only told Lance because apparantly someone else briefed him about everything already and I was told he felt strongly about it anyway.

Part of the reason why I wanted to post this was because last night isn't forgotten. I noticed this with a particular frown today. How so? Well... I tested the chat for Contention's sake when he asked me if the chat was down. He was still connecting through irc.pinkfloydyoshi, you see. I told him he wasn't, and stayed in there until he was able to go in. Lazo, who is at my house at the moment, tested the chat as well and it was fine. Anyway, so when I told Contention what the problem was and all three of us were in there, I guess it looked bad. With the three of us in there, an implication towards last night was quickly dealt out, ("oh look, the whole gang is back") so I was kind of like. "Eh. |D"

I think there was some other stuff, but yeah. >_> I can't remember anything these days. So what if this clarification section makes my post seem petty? I'd have to talk to about ten million people to get rid of the bad image caused by that misunderstanding alone, so why not go for a public announcement of that? Saves time, and time is money.

Being misinterpretted bothers me a lot, you see.

But that's what I have to say for now. I welcome different opinions and thoughts on this. Different opinions are cool. I wanted this thread for clarification of some matters, and for whatever people want to say about this, if anything. Trying to clear the air a bit, I suppose.

I used I in this post as I really don't like speaking for others even if I'm 90%-100% certain they agree with me or not.

[Not-Garr]

I was the one who prompted Ruru to go into the chat, I felt people should see what was going on in there.

I'm glad I could help clarify just what I was suggesting before the unfortunate thing happened. I can only assume my intentions were misinterpreted, or someone lost their temper and made a rash decision. I was given logs by an anonymous party as for the debate last night, and I was sort of appalled at how both parties acted at time, as if it was some sort of personal thing, though as I saw, it was mainly the "defending" party who were taking it personally.

As for me, I need to speak with PinkFloydYoshi ASAP, if he reads this. It is about the unfortunation that I wish to discuss in a perfectly reasonable manner. I have been guilty of overreacting in the past, but I hope everyone realizes I can be reasonable as well.

Also: Cool idea on posting a clarification to avoid anything being taken the wrong way, Pawy.

[Blitzzoshi]

pawy said:

...and I do believe that Gem got some sort of ban from the channel bot for saying the word sex once. That's a little... much, at least I thought as much. I did, indeed.

Actually, no. She said the word "sex" three times.

[14:08] <Gem> Snail... sex?
[14:08] * Gem was kicked by Bahamut (Watch your language!)
[14:08] * Gem ([e-mail]) has joined #yc
[14:08] <+Twi> Damn it Bahamut!
[14:08] <Gem> :C
[14:08] <+Toshi> lawl

[14:09] <Gem> Well... snail sex? I thought snails were asexual... >>
[14:09] * Gem was kicked by Bahamut (Watch your language!)
[14:09] * Gem ([e-mail]) has joined #yc

[14:10] <+Twi> Gem, I think you need register your nick
[14:10] <+Twi> sex sex sex
[14:10] <+lizard-guy> Yeah, what Twi said
[14:10] <Gem> sex
[14:10] * Bahamut sets mode: +b *!*@DD8FD5A2.82622CDB.28ECE1DB.IP
[14:10] * Gem was kicked by Bahamut (Watch your language!)
[14:10] <+Twi> Oh...we just banned Gem
[14:10] <Frogi> sex
[14:10] * Frogi was kicked by Bahamut (Watch your language!)

Note that only unregistered, unvoiced users (shown without a preceding + sign) get the kick. On the third kick in a row, it places a ban as well. When I asked Pink on the matter, he said it was to prevent advertising bots from coming in and speaking slander (though I don't even know why he does that when this is a private server, and I feel that the kick message could be a bit more descriptive, but still).

Whatever the reason, just remember that all it takes is a registration with NickServ to get autovoice and lift the autokick function. Just 30 seconds and you will no longer be classified as a potential spambot.

[emvee]

If I may, I'd like to clarify one small thing.

The quote "the whole gang is back" was in no way an implication of the events that took place. It was Thorn simply showing happiness that a lot of people from YC (the chat regulars) were all at the same place at the same time. I'm sorry you took it as some sort of derogatory saying, however it was just a show of happiness that everyone was together again.

Just throwing that out there.

[Rackinac]

I may have said it three times, but it was only a word. Sex. See? If I were to go over certain things about sex, or have a conversation on sex, then I do have a right to be banned.

See. I said it three times and I doubt anyone was emotionally scared. And I spent more like an hour trying to figure out how to use the NickServ. You know... help should be more specific... and helpful. And I still can't figure out how to useNickServ.

[Moot]

/nickserv register [password]

[PinkFloydYoshi]

It is not wise to start this argument on the board. In any case, I shall put my side of the argument across and we can see how people decide. In any case, I don't think it's fair to drag others into this argument, but hey, I didn't make this thread.

Situation met with best intentions:
Originally, the AIM chat room was found to be very popular, so I proposed the move to a constantly available IRC chatroom instead of assembling an AIM room every weekend. Not everyone can remain connected to AIM and not everyone can stand it (Understandable, I get in a right mood when audio starts playing over music I'm listening to, without my prior consent). You don't need to download a client to access the chatroom as I've made a Java client available so everyone can join in on whats going on quickly and easily.

The problem with this is that not only does the chatroom inherit the boards rules, it also (If it is to remain -s) inherits network rules. The network rules have always been strict but we never really started enforcing them until we decided that we wanted to become a serious network that will allow people from other sites and games instead of just serving the Yoshi community. To do this, we needed to start enforcing rules. We had been very lax before this point, but the second we started enforcing we were met with resistance. Of course, being the pushover I am into wanting to please as many crowds as I possibly could, #ycmature was created to meet the needs of the older more mature members of the board which lifted all restrictions and #yc remained the official room for the board. Network conditions to remain -s are that the channel must be toned down to the point where people of all ages, the lowest age group(Not the most common) can join in without being offended by foul language (Condition +G remain on to filter words in the word list) or being exposed to sexual activity, or, yiff, or explicit sexual innuendo. #yc was supposed to be a 'safe for all-ages' channel as it was a front end for visitors to the board. Anything that offended anyone in that room would look bad on the boards reputation and that one person might spread their experiences around causing all sorts of mischief.

I remember saying in another thread that I respect that people want to yiff or do sexual-related RPs and they are free to do it, just not in #yc because that's a break of the network rules, and I *really* don't want to have to de-list #yc from the servers channel line-up and remove it as a featured channel from the network's site. I want to advertise the chat room. I don't want someone following a link from one of my sites and being offended by what they are seeing because there are a great amount of young fans of Yoshi that want Yoshi's image to be preserved as an innocent character, I do, but I don't try to stop others from expressing themselves, if that's what they want to do, fine, just don't do it in #yc and I and no-one else will complain. We are administrators, we are there to make sure the environment is safe and sound, and if there are faults, we fix them straight away so people are happy.

That is all I ask. If #ycmature isn't that popular, then that's possibly because the mature population isn't actually as big as you think. Who knows? I'm only in there to maintain 'some' official connection with the board.

The filter-kicking bot is there and set up that way to stop people re-offending. If you are kicked, that is a warning. 3 kicks in a row and you will be automatically banned for an hour or until one of administration notices. Same with flooding. 5 lines in 10 seconds. Exceed 5 lines in 10 seconds and that will be a kick. 3 kicks and you will be kick-banned for an hour or until one of administration notices.

It's not a censorship, I just believe that *everyone* of *all* ages should be able to join the channel and have a good time instead of being exposed to the odd word their parents or themselves won't appreciate.

...and I've already spoken to Gar.

Addition:
Channel regulars, whether I've asked you already or not if you're happy with the way things are being run, could you please respond here giving your opinion on the network and it's staff's performance, and whether you agree as to whether I should be enforcing as strictly as I should, given my reasons above? Be honest, please?

[emvee]

Honestly, as I've told you before several times Pink, Anbraxas is the first IRC network where I've actually felt comfortable. I feel the administration is doing a smash up job, considering what you put up with day in and day out. Really, I sometimes find myself going outside of the ruleset, and I apologise for that, but I know they're in effect for a reason. Perhaps some of the things are a little too harsh, though I can understand why they're being done, such as the kicks and ban set when the word "sex" is brought up.

Really, all I can say on the issue is that I feel the administration is doing great, and that no more leniency is really needed. It seems fair enough as it is, in my opinion. Thanks to the channel I've toned down my cursing online, so it's been a benefit to me. I know that if I really feel the need to make jokes or say things that cross the line, I can do it outside of the channel, so I suppose all this doesn't really affect me as much as it would others.

I'd say keep doing things as you are. It is your network afterall. I see no oppression or persecution, so I see no problems. Keep on keepin on, good sir.

[Lord of the Dance]

If you guys were more lenient I'd leave. My parents are pretty strict, and they put up with the #yc mainly because of those rules. So if the rules get bended, I get kicked off the computer.
I really think you don't need to get any stricter, but you don't need to give people more freedom of conversation, either. #ycmature was made for that very reason, it seems, so I really don't think it's fair for other people to complain about the rules. If they want to bring it up or make jokes that cross the line, they can do it in there. Which is completely fine with me.

[Masakuni]

I don't know, I think there really is no need to be overly strict. I mean, I can agree with Pawy, that the obvious, like strong language, in-depth discussions about sex, etc. Those should never be allowed. However, words like "sex", "hell", the like, and other little things like that should be OK as long as they aren't like...overused so much, or taken too far.

So yeah, that's my 2 cents.

[Blitzzoshi]

As someone that comes from a community where we are always banning n00bs, I'm actually kinda used to the strictness. I typically just see a list of rules and go "Oh, that's how they do things around here." No suggestive stuff? So be it. I can put that kind of stuff in another channel if I wanted to. Just remember that the strictness could be a lot worse (IE. people being banned left and right for merely breathing). I honestly think it's pretty balanced the way we have it.

[Electrometer Prime]

I dont really notice the strictness, mainly because I'm from #ylore and there are really no strict rules there which is probably because there is really nobody there. I occasionaly talk on #yc and idle there all the time. Guess I need to pay more attention.